Thanks for your detailed reply... and your very detailed image. :-)
Do you know of any documentation on the need for center filters? eg;
Brian says not needed at 115mm but you say 90mm does need one.
Chuck Norcutt
Dawid Loubser wrote:
> Hi Chuck,
>
> I very regularly shoot a Linhof Technorama 617S which is fitted with
> a Schneider Super Angulon 90mm f/5.6 XL lens. I know one can go even
> wider
> with the 72mm XL lens, but the 90mm is already incredibly wide,
> similar to an 18mm on
> 35mm film.
>
> With colour slide film, it is absolutely necessary to use a center
> filer if you want
> even exposure. Don't even try it without one unless you want the
> effect. The light falloff
> is severe.
>
> So, regardless of marketing (e.g. Linhof's), these are not "hand-held
> large format" cameras,
> since you are starting out with an f/11 lens, with shallow DOF and
> guess-focus. You want to put
> this baby on a tripod and use at least f/11 (effective f/22 with
> center filter).
>
> When you do this, though, the quality is marvellous. The Scheneider
> lens is perfect perfect perfect
> right into the corners, zero CA, distortion or flare. It's just perfect.
>
> I am not yet a scanning expert (and desperately would like a 5x7
> enlarger so I can print my 6x17cm
> negatives without having to resort to the pain of scanning) but this
> (+crop) should give you an idea
> of of the information content and colour richness of one of these
> 6x17cm slides as scanned with
> an el-cheapo V700 scanner:
>
> http://fc04.deviantart.net/fs50/f/2009/282/a/4/Berlin_Falls_Vista_Crop_by_philosomatographer.jpg
> (Schneider 90mm at f/16, Fuji Provia 100F)
>
> You can spend hours with a loupe on one of these images, it's beyond
> any current single-shot
> digital capture.
>
> So, to answer your question, a camera like this gives *much* more
> resolution. Not a little bit more.
> Not 3x more. WAY more. On a good day, I can coax 240 megapixels out of
> one of these slides.
>
> But scanning is a pain in the ass (I hate it) - I'd much rather print
> 6x17cm B&W negs in the
> darkroom. And sometimes my thoughts wander to rather getting a proper
> 4x5in camera, just for the
> movements and more precise focusing / composition. But then it'd take
> 5mins to set up any shot, whereas
> with a 6x17cm rollfilm camera, I can be done in 1 minute or less (or a
> couple of seconds when you do use it
> hand-held, it is possible), as they are so simple to operate.
>
> If you don't want the multi-format / shifting gadgetry etc. that the
> cheap chinese 6x17cm cameras offer, I can
> wholeheartedly recommend looking for a second-hand linhof. The
> difference in feel is similar to a
> Leica MP compared to a Voigtlander Bessa. Sure, both will do the job,
> but the one is just so much
> sweeter to use, and will probably last a lifetime.
>
> Except for the stupid cheap shutter release cable (which runs from the
> shutter button to the lens)
> which I had to replace, after a 15 years lifespan. It was very cheap
> (EUR 25.00) and easy from
> Linhof directly, though. Everything else will be indestructible.
>
> The Linhof viewfinder is also much better - much
> less distortion. EVen the little bit it has, though, is too much -
> it's sometimes difficult to line up
> shots without tilt. Even a tiny bit of tilt really shows up in this
> wide format.
>
> I think the shifting on these cameras are a useless gimmick. You're
> either guessing, or you have to take off the
> film back, slide in a ground glass, compose, and do the whole switch
> again. If you want this, just get a proper
> view camera, it'll be cheaper, and better.
>
> Using a 6x17 (vs a view camera) is much more like a viewfinder /
> rangefinder camera (vs an SLR) - immensely good
> quality, high speed / agility, at the cost of flexibility and
> compositional accuracy.
>
> Still - it is a lot of fun - I can really recommend it.
>
> Dawid
>
>
> On 25 Dec 2009, at 6:11 PM, Chuck Norcutt wrote:
>
>> I know Brian ordered (and maybe got) an Obsession 6x17 camera from the
>> guy in Oz who builds them. Anyone have experience using these things.
>> Advice? What about the (relatively) inexpensive Chinese Gaoersi
>> cameras
>> on ebay... such as this one (which also has shift capability)
>> <http://cgi.ebay.com/New-Gaoersi-617-SHIFT-6X17-CAMERA_W0QQitemZ330344364035QQcmdZViewItemQQptZFilm_Cameras?hash=item4cea0ef803
>>
>> The Gaoersi does multiple format (6x12, 6x14, 6x17). What about
>> lenses
>> and, in particular the need for center filters to control vignetting.
>> Needed at 6x17 but are they also needed for 6x12 or 6x14?
>>
>> I could see shooting film with something like these cameras provided
>> it
>> gives *much* more resolution than my 5D but shoots roll film without
>> the
>> bother of a 4x5.
>>
>> Chuck Norcutt
>
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